Universal 5424 Starter Solonoid

[mackinac]

Sometimes I have to press the starter button on my 1981 P-35 two or three times to get the starter to engage. It's getting worse. Based on some "Nigel Calder" tests I think my batteries are good. When it doesn't engage, I think I can hear a single click from the engine compartment. My guess is it's the solenoid.

Question #1: On a Universal 5424, can I replace the solenoid only, or do I need to replace the entire starter assembly?

Question #2: If I need to replace the starter assembly, is it a simple bolt on item, or do I need to shim it or something to align it.

Thanks.

[tseibert]

I have the same issue with my 1981 but I think I have a high resistance connection somewhere in the circuit, either the wiring connections or the push button because a few times I've had to push the starter button 20 or more times without the solenoid engaging and if I take a short jumper wire and attach one of the clips to the solenoid connection and then touch the main starter lug it engages first time every, time. You may want to try this test (carefully) first). It makes me think my problem is in the push button or the harness. I noted the solenoid connection on my boat is just a slide on spade lug (and a bit green) so I changed that thinking I had found the problem. It's better but I still have the problem intermittenly. (you may want to squeese the spade lug or verify its tight).I believe a test would be test your battery voltage with a VOM and then see what type of voltage you have at the solenoid when you operate the button and look for a significant voltage drop.
#1 from what I remember the solenoid is a seperate unit (like on a chevy) 2 screws to remove.
#2 Not sure if there's a shim ( I have seen thin spacers on cars). It does look somewhat accesable don't for get to pull the cables off the batteries first or be sure main switch is off to avoid unscheduled welding.
Best wish's on correcting this

[tseibert]

Check the Universal 5416/5424 service manual online at www.alohaowners.com/pages/manuals/manuals.htm
page 16 shows the starter. Looks like a seperate solonoid but looks like the screws for it face towards the rear, might have to pull starter to get access. There's also a wiring digram on page 19 that may apply .

[tseibert]

I found this on www3.telus.net/Atomic_4_Eng_Service/Other_Sites.htm
It sounds similiar to your question, hope it helps

Lately when I try to start my old Universal diesel the solenoid clicks but the starter does not turn the engine until I've tried it 3 or 4 times. I charged the battery and made sure the alternator belt is tight and the alternator is charging. Should I replace the solenoid, or the starter and solenoid?

This is a common problem on older Universal diesels, because they take a lot of current to power the starter with the glow plugs also on, and many of them were fitted with rather small, and pretty long, battery cables. It is usually not the starter or the starter solenoid actually causing the problem, but because it's the starter that's not turning it's the first thing most people want to change (even though they're very expensive). The problem is often a voltage drop in the starter circuit - usually corroded battery cables up under the plastic (even though the terminals look nice and shiny), or a worn out battery main switch, or a bad ground at the engine, although sometimes it's just old batteries getting weak.

Make sure your batteries are in good condition and fully charged. Turn the battery main switch to the position you use for starting (usually the starter battery is designated #2). Have someone hold the glow plug button on to put a load on the battery and use a digital voltmeter to check the voltage drop between each section of the battery cable circuit as follows:
1: from the starter battery + terminal to the battery main switch terminal for the starter battery
2: from the battery main switch terminal for the starter battery to the battery main switch terminal "C"
3: from the battery main switch terminal "C" to the starter solenoid + terminal
4: from the starter battery - terminal to the starter casting

Any voltage reading over half a volt means there is a resistance in the circuit that must be fixed. If there is no voltage drop remove the starter / solenoid and take it to an automotive electric shop for a rebuild. That is the most cost-effective way to get it repaired. Usually the shop will simply replace the solenoid as part of the rebuild.

[mackinac]

Thanks. This is helpful. I think my problem might be my 4 year old Group 31 Deka Marine batteries. I have had them home for the winter and have been charging them with a Guest Charge-Pro 10 amp three-stage charger. They won't hold a charge above 12.3 Volts, which I think indicates they will only hold a 50% charge (full charge should be 12.6 volts??). I have the old-fashioned Motorola alternator, which I have read "leads to permanenty undercharged batteries." Undercharged batteries sulphate, and I never equalize them, so I think they are the culprit.

I think I will replace the batteries in the spring and try that before I tear out the starter. I noticed Sears has Group 27 Deep Cycle Marine/RV Batteries for $80/each - CHEAP compared to the Marine Deka Group 31s. They are the same physical size and have roughly equivalent CCA and Amp-hours. Any body have any eqperience with Sear Deep Cycles for DUAL PURPOSE appications??

A better fix would be a more sophisticated alternator and voltage regulator with Equalization-stage, but I'll probably just replace batteries every 4 years.

Thanks again.